Kristina Hoeppner: 0:05

Welcome to'Create. Share. Engage.' This is the podcast about portfolios for learning and more for educators, learning designers, and managers keen on integrating portfolios with their education and professional development practices. 'Create. Share. Engage,.' is brought to you by the Mahara team at Catalyst IT. My name is Kristina Hoeppner. Associate Professor Dr Mpho-Entle Modise from the University of South Africa(UNISA) and Professor Dr Norman Vaughan from Mount Royal University in Canada are my guests today. They are the editors of the book 'Digital resilience of ePortfolios during and beyond the COVID-19 pandemic- Lessons for the future'. That book was launched last November at the ICDE World Conference 2025, which incidentally, was held in Te Whanganui- a-Tara Wellington. So I had the opportunity to meet Norm in person, and I'm now also excited to meet Mpho-Entle through this conversation that we are having today. Many thanks to the two of you for today's chat that is spanning the globe as the three of us are in so very different time zones. Mpho-Entle, what is your current role at your university?

Mpho-Entle Modise: 1:27

Thank you so much, Kristina, for this wonderful opportunity to have a chat with you about our project. Currently, I'm an Associate Professor in the Department of Curriculum and Instructional Studies in the College of Education at the University of South Africa In South Africa, and I teach a third-year module called 'Instructional studies in context' for the BEd programme. It's just basically instructional methods in various contexts that we teach our student teachers.

Kristina Hoeppner: 1:56

For how long have you been working with portfolios? If I read your personal portfolio website, correctly, it probably all started around 2010?

Mpho-Entle Modise: 2:07

Yes, I was introduced to paper-based portfolios a few years ago. UNISA, at the time, we had students coming in and submitting paper-based portfolios, you know, the big files for summative assessment at the end of the semester or academic year. But it was in 2013 when I was introduced to electronic, web-based portfolios through the Capacity-Building Program between UNISA and the University of Maryland, Global Campus (UMGC). It was quite a fascinating way to learn with portfolios. So it was really interesting that I could express myself as a learner. And later on, when I joined academia in 2018, the module that I was given then at the time, was also offered purely online, and we're using Mahara ePortfolio platform to teach the module. So it was quite an interesting journey there.

Kristina Hoeppner: 2:58

And so you've been teaching with portfolio since, right?

Mpho-Entle Modise: 3:01

Yes, and any module that I get, whatever assessment plan it is, I always try to change it to be either a portfolio or an ePortfolio.

Kristina Hoeppner: 3:10

Wonderful, certainly championing portfolios then at the southern end of Africa. Norm, what is your current role at your university?

Norm Vaughan: 3:20

Well, just Kristina, again, thank you so much for having us here. We've been working together for a few years, and like you said, geographically, we're quite different. We're still in winter up here in Canada, but very similar, I'm also involved in a Bachelor of Education programme at my university, and currently I'm focused on teaching the educational technology and the assessment courses. So a really good fit for ePortfolios.

Kristina Hoeppner: 3:46

When were you introduced to portfolios first?

Norm Vaughan: 3:49

It sounds like a similar story. For me, it was a little earlier. I started with our education programme back in 1996. At that time, it was a paper-based programme, but you know, the modalities changed, but the real focus, I think, is students being really intentional about documenting their growth and development as they go through a Bachelor of Education programme. It's interesting as well, just to see how the profession has changed here in Alberta because once our students graduate from our programme and go into professional teaching, they're required to have an annual growth plan that used to be paper-based as well. It's gone digital or ePortfolio. So it's really wonderful. We're sort of able to get them started in the pre-service programme, and we have gone through a various number of different platforms for using it. But it's wonderful because our university allows them to continue to use the platform - we're using Google Sites at the moment - so they can continue to use that in their professional practice. That's been really exciting for me to see because often this is a new concept for students. There's a lot of resistance, but feed can bring in alumni or principals or administrators so they can see that this is really going to be p art of their professional and future practice.

Kristina Hoeppner: 5:04

So you're both teaching in a Bachelor in Education. Do you remember when your first collaboration was and what it was about?

Norm Vaughan: 5:13

Talk about the Commonwealth of Learning.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 5:15

Yes, Commonwealth of Learning mentorship programme that I saw an advert at my university, and I applied. And to be honest, I did say this to Prof Norm because of ePortfolios, especially in the African context, they're still very new, and people are still not sure you know whether they can use them. So I was also very worried about who the mentor is going to be and whether that mentor would really have passion about ePortfolios, and when Prof Norm selected me in our first meeting, he was super excited about this topic. I couldn't believe it. Couldn't believe it.

Norm Vaughan: 5:51

I think it really is that shared passion. It takes, you know, a community, it takes a village to raise someone. But even though we're in completely different context, we're trying to do the same thing for similar students. It was really exciting for us as well because before we got into doing this book, I think we just naturally collaborate well together. But we were able to actually put an article together, a research article, comparing how we were using these ePortfolios in our different programmes. And I'm going to leave it at that because then the snowball just started building [laughs].

Mpho-Entle Modise: 6:24

We also had quite a few presentation invitations - UNISA and also Nigeria we had. We also went to present together in a panel discussion in Rwanda at the eLearning Africa Conference. So we've been dancing a lot together on this topic [laughs].

Kristina Hoeppner: 6:40

So you were already a well oiled duo once it came to the book, which is going to be today's focus, really, because 730 pages is no small feat. And so you too are the editors of the book 'Digital resilience of ePortfolios during and beyond the COVID-19 pandemic- Lessons for the future'. Why did you invite the portfolio community to share their stories?

Mpho-Entle Modise: 7:06

I noticed that ePortfolios were still very much in their infancy as teaching and learning tools within the higher education African context, especially in ODL, you know, open distance learning environment. So during my involvement with the Commonwealth of Learning Mentorship Programme with Prof Norm, and following the publication of our article, I became interested in creating an ePortfolio resource that will be designed to support scholars in sharing their experiences and the strategies they use in their various contexts and how they integrate ePortfolios in those environments. So I shared the idea with Prof Norm, and he immediately approved it. His response was incredibly encouraging and motivating, and as my mentor, I really appreciated his affirmation. So we invited the portfolio community so that they can have a platform to share their stories because we both recognised that the COVID-19 pandemic reshaped everything about teaching and learning and professional practice in so many ways. We realised that there's no one single perspective that could capture the experiences that we expose to COVID-19. The portfolios became more than assessment tools and because my observation is that in Africa, ePortfolios are only used mostly as assessment tool, and I feel like we are losing an opportunity to use them also as teaching and learning tool that promote reflective learning. So ultimately, we wanted a book that reflects the community of practice, that one could learn from one another, that we can adapt together and continue to evolve as we imagine the future of ePortfolios in the changing world.

Norm Vaughan: 8:45

They say curiosity killed the cat. I was really curious to know what was going on with ePortfolios around the world, but especially in Africa, but also just as we rolled out, I think, it was wonderful because I think there's other people similar to us that they're very passionate about ePortfolios, but they're often on their own in their own institutions. So I felt this was really exciting because not only did it allow them to connect with other people that share the similar passion, but I think, it allowed them to elevate their work. So at their home institutions because I've heard this as others that like, listen, this is happening not only at my university, but a similar university to us or look what's happening in New Zealand and or Australia. So I'm really excited about how this rolled out. That there's other people that have our passion, and this is an easy work with portfolios because, I think, Mpho-Entle mentioned a really important part, too, that it really is more than assessment and both of us being in an education programme, Mpho-Entle often uses the word 'identity making' because this really is helping a student - we call them teacher candidates - transition from being a student to a teacher and having this reflective document and seeing their own growth really helps them with their identity as a teacher. It was just so exciting to get involved with this. It was so exciting that everybody else was excited.

Kristina Hoeppner: 10:04

[laughs] Being one of the co-authors of one of the many chapters, I was also very excited because it felt like we are stopping for a moment and reflecting on what had happened over the previous roughly five years, and intentionally looking back and then seeing how that influenced where we are at the moment.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 10:29

Just want to tap on the excitement that we actually received 84 proposals at the beginning, and even though we ended up with 43 chapters, obviously we had to go through them. But in the whole we received proposals, even from high school teachers. That was quite interesting to see that portfolios are not just for higher education. There's other adopters who wants to come in and share their stories of how they're using ePortfolios at that educational level.

Kristina Hoeppner: 10:58

Mhh and also the many different countries that people came from. There is quite a nice focus on African voices, but also the wider international community.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 11:09

We had, I think, about five continents represented.

Kristina Hoeppner: 11:12

That is fantastic. I had already mentioned earlier that your book is not a small one with its 730 pages. You did publish it under a Creative Commons license. It is available electronically, and of course, there's tons of resources included for each chapter. What themes did you see emerge in the book through the various chapters?

Mpho-Entle Modise: 11:39

Initially, we had about eight themes that we saw coming in, but as we continue to read and to re-read the manuscripts, then we came to seven themes, and mostly you'll see that people were talking about digital resilience, how they used the ePortfolios during the time of crisis, during COVID-19, to provide that continuance in their education spaces. And a lot of other authors also touched on the challenges of implementing ePortfolios within their various contexts. There was a lot of writing also about rethinking of assessment through ePortfolios for authentic assessment of learning. There were some chapters that looked at the design, the impactful design of ePortfolios within the teacher education and professional development also came through very strong; professional development using ePortfolios in teacher education and empowering educators to use ePortfolios.

Norm Vaughan: 12:40

The one thing that came out for me was that it really is authentic assessment. Because, man, it just, it seems to just explode every day, the use of generative AI. So I'm not going to say that a portfolio process is AI proof, but it really is about yourself[laughs]. So it's been interesting for me to observe our student use of portfolios because, you know, I hear from colleagues about issues with the use of generative AI in writing assignments, but since this is such a personal documentation, sure, you can use the AI to find sources, resources, and things like that, but I'm really excited to see how this really is - again, it's an authentic assessment - and if it's done the right way, process for the students. One of the things we talked about getting the mindset that it really is about lifelong learning, and I think this is so important for the students in our Bachelor of Education programmes. You know, once you graduate, you're not done. This is a lifelong process. The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it's open.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 13:43

Yes, it's very interesting, the practical design principles that emerged through some of the chapters. For me also renders the portfolio book as a practical guideline where colleagues can look at and see how they can design or amend whatever their approach is that they were using previously to continue using the ePortfolios effectively. The thing that also came through was the issue of reflective practice that enabled by the ePortfolios as teaching and learning tools. That is very important.

Kristina Hoeppner: 14:17

Yes, and what I really like about the book is that it brings together deep research, but also shares case studies. Is the one or two of the stories that have been shared that have stood out to you. It's almost like picking your favourite child amongst 43, isn't it?

Norm Vaughan: 14:36

Well, that's what I was gonna say. What's exciting for me was just the themes coming out. So maybe not a favourite chapter, but just it was so exciting because, you know, what we did, we were looking at the abstracts coming in really quickly, and try to sort of compartmentalise them, whereas I really, really like the way that the book came together for the themes and the reflective practice. So we were building on each other. And for me, I'm not saying it was a favourite, but it was one of Mpho-Entle's colleagues, Hugo Lotriet.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 15:10

I was thinking about that, too.

Norm Vaughan: 15:11

It was just he's thinking a little more forward than I was. I think, for all of us that were tangled up in this generative AI, and that's what makes me excited about the ePortfolio process, just how personal it is and it's meaningful. Because, you know, we talk about a surface or a deep approach to learning, and just I find with my students, there's so many economic pressures, family pressures, everything, that they're often looking at the least resistance. You know, the easiest way to get through an education programme. And I find this is exciting because this actually makes them stop. You mentioned, Kristina, and both, Mpho-Entle, the reflective nature, but they go,'Wait a minute. This is meaningful for me. This isn't just doing this for someone else. This is really something that I'm internalising and I'm really learning from.' So I don't want to pick any special ones, but that one really was interesting for me about how we can use the AI, but that it's really helping you learn more about yourself and who you'll be as a future educator.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 16:13

Kristina, I don't really have a specific favourite chapter. The whole book is still a wow for me, the fact that we are even sitting here talking about it is a big wow for me, and a big wow for every author and co-author that contributed to the book. But I would say, taken from what Prof just said, in terms of AI, I have been a little bit a coward, in a way, if I may say because I've been thinking about AI and ePortfolio, AI in ePortfolio, but I never went one step ahead. So what's exciting about the chapter that he's talking about with AI, it's for me, it's just that he was bold enough to say, let's talk about it. But the whole book, for me is such a confirmation and affirmation of my fears and my excitement, in the sense that I was very afraid that, I feel like, within the African context, we are not running along everybody else, as far as portfolios are concerned. But when I saw people from African continent submitting stuff and contributing, that excited me so much.

Kristina Hoeppner: 17:16

Mhh. There's so many different ways of describing portfolio practice, which the book also exemplifies, that a portfolio is not one way. It's not just for assessment, it's not just for lifelong learning, it's not just for development, but it can be for all of those things. So it really depends on the specific context in which you want to use portfolios and then pick one or two of the elements for which portfolios can be used and make them work for you. Mpho-Entle, you had already mentioned that the pandemic has changed portfolio practice. Many more people have picked it up during that time. I had also heard that institutions started using portfolios as alternatives to written exams because, of course, where everybody was in lockdown, it was not so easy to sit exams, and people were navigating, shall we do remote exams? How does that work? What is the academic integrity with them? So portfolios had been seen as one of the alternatives to the traditional exam. In which other ways do you think the pandemic has changed or advanced portfolio practice?

Mpho-Entle Modise: 18:25

The COVID-19 pandemic, we all experienced it as educators. We've read a lot of reports and research that those people who have already been using technology for teaching and learning, it was quite easy for them to transition, you know, during the lockdown, when we were not allowed to be in each other's faces. But what the ePortfolio did was it was a catalytic enabler for those who adopted it during that time and those who had been using it before COVID-19 also found it easier to just transition because we are already using Mahara, for example, we were already on that platform with our students. And specifically for me, since I'm coming from distance education context, where we don't really see our students in person, using the portfolio was quite easy. I think that the pandemic itself gave the use of ePortfolio a big push. And has now - we've got so many people who said, 'during COVID-19, we use the portfolio, this is our story, and we want to share it.' Prof, I don't know if you want to add on that?

Norm Vaughan: 19:28

Well, just a couple. We're in similar programmes, but a different context, like you said, you're at a open distance learning institution, whereas I'm at more of a conventional, physical institution. So a couple of things happened that I was happy with [laughs] is that everybody had to work together. We had to work with our IT department, our teaching and learning department. So it really accelerated the evolution and the use of digital technologies in our entire institution. But the other thing it started to reduce barriers and increase the acceptance of the use of ePortfolios because, Mpho-Entle, maybe it's like you, I often find I'm the one like, 'let's use it, let's use it,' and I get a lot of resistance [laughs] from my colleagues, but a lot of learning is experiential. So it didn't reduce all the barriers, but at least it allowed some of my colleagues to see the potential and how we can work together, we can learn from each other. That's really what learning is. It' about the collaborative experience. The idea that we need to work together, and we need to start talking about what's happening in each other's courses, so that, you know, the portfolio, I often talk about it as being the spine or the backbone of our programme. It's something that we really should have from the first to the final year of our programme. And you know, our courses are the connective tissue. They connect to it, but we're moving the students through in one direction, not in a bunch of random ways.

Kristina Hoeppner: 20:51

Mhh. In which ways are your faculty then supported to implement portfolios to change their curriculum, Norm?

Norm Vaughan: 21:00

We're really fortunate. Being a physical thing, back when I was young, we used to call them libraries. They're called learning centres. So we're really lucky. We've got all the support in the building. You can actually walk down to the Teaching and Learning Centre. We've got an IT person and things like that. But you know, the one thing I've been really trying to encourage people is the best way to learn about ePortfolios is to create your own. Tthat's so important because one, you learn what the students are going through experientially, but then you can model the practice for the students as well. We've got about 20 full-time faculty members. We're not that big a programme here, but there's only two of us, and we're getting towards the end of our career. But it's a joy. I just love keeping my own ePortfolio up to date [laughs]. And honestly, it's the only way I know if somebody asked me, you know what paper you've done, what research or what are you doing recently, I've got one place I can go to. It's not hidden in a Word document somewhere else. I want to share my practice with others. So Kristina, just to go back to it, they have plenty of support. It's that mindset, and it really frustrates me because now that the pandemic is gone, and it wasn't that long ago, people too quickly go back to their comfort level. And I know we're all busy, but I think this is so meaningful for the students.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 22:21

One of the things about portfolios and ePortfolios, when Norm talking about working together, it's got this, we call it Ubuntu in Africa, that I am because you are. You also talked about community. There's something about the portfolio that people who use portfolios, they share easily their resources, things like rubrics, they're everywhere online. And people who are complaining about ePortfolios taking a lot of time and being a lot of work, I want to focus on the positive, but at the same time, it has a lot of sharing attitude within those that are using the portfolio. That's one thing I like that I really appreciate about portfolio. But in terms of support from my institution, again, I want to be positive, but we must be realistic and be real and be truthful. We are a huge institution. For example, currently my module I've got about, as I'm talking to you today, student enrolments is 12,088 and the closing date for registration is still end of March. So between now and end of March, we might end up to 14,000 and you can't really use ePortfolio with such huge student numbers, and our IT people also get frustrated, I guess. Imagine how many students you have to support. Those realities are what sometimes, you know some of us are faced with, and I guess sometimes I'm also speaking on behalf of those who don't want to adopt a norm is because, how do you begin to implement ePortfolio in such a large module? If we can have those talks, and then people can help us and re-think out of the box, and then really, it would be such a beautiful thing to experience teaching and learning and assessing with ePortfolios.

Kristina Hoeppner: 24:00

Maybe we need a special session on huge courses and portfolio ideas because 12,000 is certainly the biggest number of a course that I've heard where you might want to use portfolios. Otherwise it was 400, 500 students in one but yeah, 12,000 is certainly a different dimension that would be good to unpack what some strategies are that have worked for others in large courses, but even kind of just about a 30th. Have you seen any major shifts in how portfolios are used or how they are being started to be used at institutions due to the changing practices that we had seen during the pandemic that were introduced? And yes, some people go back to their old practices, but others might actually really want to continue with what they had started.

Norm Vaughan: 24:52

I'm just going to jump in and go back to that previous thing about how important it is to do it in a collaborative, a community fashion because it was interesting for me to see this book roll out because we're talking a lot of chapters, a lot of people. But we were able to put this together from start to finish in nine months, and I think it's because of the collaborative nature. There's little bumps and humps and stuff like that, but there was people were able to get their initial chapters in in time. They were really keen and did really good peer review of each other. That's going to be a really key thing to really open up the collaboration. If we're going to do this in a meaningful way, you've got to reach out and work collaboratively with others. I think the key really is for the support - ask for help, don't be embarrassed. We can all learn from each other. I am who I am because of you. So that's the key for me, and that's why I love working with a portfolio community, and Kristina, it's been great to work with you. It just seems that people that are drawn to this practice really are open about sharing their practice and open to learning from others as well.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 26:04

From where we are, and I say this cautiously, that as much as we want to collaborate and help each other and work with each other, as I'm looking at my students now at UNISA, we don't have external markers any more, and the eTutors have been taken away. We now have what we call the adjunct academics who now need to take over some of the tasks and that, you know, the academics are now also supposed to mark huge amounts of assessment. In my module, I need to mark up to 2,000 scripts per assignment. So I need to change the assessment plan and strategy going forward, imagine if I know that you are in the same situation, it will be difficult for me to ask help from me because I'm assuming that you are also drowning. So this kind of environment also create, you know, the silos and those villages that are far from each other, but with technology and with that mindset change that we will somehow meet, and I believe that portfolios have that ability to bring us together.

Kristina Hoeppner: 27:09

That is quite a different situation that you are in with so so many students in just one class. It will be exciting to talk about at some point and see what others in the same space could do. What are some of the takeaways for you from the book?

Norm Vaughan: 27:27

The key takeaway for me is I'm not alone. Other people are interested in this, and it's on a global level. There's other people that have a shared passion for portfolios, and that was exciting. The other thing is the challenge of these at scale because it's so powerful for students. Just my observation over many, many years is just they love that they're doing it for themselves, that this just isn't to keep Norm happy or a hoop to go through in order to get the mark for the module or course. The last thing is, as we talked about significant challenges remain, especially as we increase the number of students. There's only 24 hours a day and there's only seven days a week, and I don't know what we're going to do with that. So those are my three, the global interest, the idea of the transformative nature of portfolios, but that there are significant challenges.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 28:20

Twenty-four hours a day and 12,000 students and one Mpho-Entle [laughs]. I agree with you, Prof Norm, that the global interest in ePortfolios is really, really visible, especially in the book project itself. Yet I get the feeling that there's a bit of misunderstanding of ePortfolios as teaching tools because other people just see it as assessment only, something to be dropped off at the end of term, whereas there's a lot of benefits, and one of those benefits is reflective practice that portfolios force you as a learner, as you go through your study material, your assessed assignments, when you look at the comments differently when you're doing ePortfolios intentionally so that you can improve in your next attempt or your next assignment. So yes, there's a lot of work to be done. I feel we need to educate each other more about the benefits of teaching with ePortfolios because I feel if I'm a teacher and I'm not enjoying using this tool, how do I expect the students to receive it with a positive mind? So if the educators clearly understand what benefits they are for them and also for their learners, then it would be such a beautiful thing to be used.

Kristina Hoeppner: 29:34

That goes back to what Norm said earlier, that if you want to learn about portfolios and how best to use them is create your own so that you can experience it. Because it's not like a multiple choice test where you fill in some boxes on a piece of paper or on screen these days, but it does change how you think about teaching, how you think about learning, because it is that integration of knowledge, of learning and also the reflection about it and bringing yourself in that makes it so very different from other practices, therefore needing that special attention in order to get started, which I think is a good way because it does help bring all of the learning together. And doesn't just say, okay, I've read this, and this is how I summarise it, but really, what do I take out of that? Now to our last three questions in the quick answer round. Which words or short phrases do you use to describe portfolio work?

Norm Vaughan: 30:35

We call them professional learning plans. So PLPs is our big acronym. The idea of self empowerment and transformation. Those are my three [laughs].

Kristina Hoeppner: 30:44

Thank you, and Mpho-Entle?,

Mpho-Entle Modise: 30:46

Highly reflective - ePortfolios promote reflective practice, and they are culturally responsive teaching and learning tools. They're very flexible. You can teach any subject whatsoever at any educational level. And they're very good for personalised and collaborative teaching and learning. And lastly, for me personally, they are very fun way to teach and learn.

Kristina Hoeppner: 31:10

Thank you. Mpho-Entle, what tip do you have for learning designers or instructors who create portfolio activities?

Mpho-Entle Modise: 31:18

In my culture, we say you must taste the medicine before you give it to a child. Oftentimes, when you buy food, a mother would before giving the food, a spoon to the baby, would pass it by their mouth first. So my tip would be, how would you support your learners if you don't have any experience whatsoever in creating your own portfolio? Just one last tip. I had quite a few [laughs]. I think it's important, and this comes from my experience that we give our learners options as institutions. We mustn't just put one platform in front of the learners. That facilitated resistance to adopting them because you didn't give them options. But if you give them opportunity to choose which platform they would want to use, then they're able to go on various platforms and see which ones it's easier for them or works better for them, and in that way, it will make the learners to own their own learning journeys and feel like they've got some level of control.

Kristina Hoeppner: 32:18

Mhh. Norm, what it's your tip?

Norm Vaughan: 32:21

A lot of our learning designers don't have the first hand experience. That was the thing just to emphasise that, over and over and over is Mpho-Entle mentioned the joy that by doing it, it's just not a task. It really is a joy to discover yourself.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 32:36

I think it's important for educators to really design portfolio activities that provide learners with an opportunity for authentic reflection. That forces students to actually, authentically, critically think about their learning and how they learn, and everything else. Whether it's self-reflection or group reflections, but those activities that creatively forces students to pause and think, I think they're very important. It's also important to connect your artefacts to the course outcomes. EPortfolios is not just for fun, but it must be meaningful. It really must be related to the content or the subject that you're teaching, so that the students, they can see value.

Kristina Hoeppner: 33:17

Yeah, and especially, also make it part of the course so that it's not standing aside in that extra that you can do, but that it really integrates in it.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 33:27

I think it's important also to use students as co-teachers. What I do is I get those students that are bright, that are doing their portfolios, they're running with it, and you know, they're doing that, enjoying it, ask them to be group leaders and help others. That works miracles. It empowers the students themselves, and you know, students sometimes also learn better from other students. And ePortfolio has that element of giving students an opportunity to interact with each other. Something that we've been talking about quite a lot on online learning, you know, student engagement, student to student interactions. EPortfolios is wonderful tool for that.

Kristina Hoeppner: 34:07

We do see that a lot of programmes rely on peer mentors, peer coaches that are helping the students in the way that you've just explained. What advice do you have for portfolio authors for your students or maybe even your faculty that you want to use portfolios?

Norm Vaughan: 34:26

Take ownership and pride in your portfolio. Make it a reflection of who you are and also who you want to become. And I just want to build on that because Mpho-Entle mentioned the importance of it being culturally responsive. Canada, we're a land of immigrants, and we have all kinds of new Canadians, we've got our First Nations, our indigenous population, and it's been really exciting for me to see how people really celebrate who they are, but celebrating their culture. My wife always tells me the strength of an ecosystem is its diversity, and it's so exciting for these young people, really, to take pride in themselves. We have a lot of indigenous cultures, but a lot of people coming from New Zealand, Australia, South Africa, all over. So it's really exciting for me, for them to take pride in who they are, but in pride of where they've come and to share that with others. Because this is so important, because when they graduate from their programme, they're going to go into classrooms in our city that almost look like the United Nations. We have people from all over the world, but it's so neat for them to see that you know, don't lose your culture is who you are. Portfolios are more than text now, the artefacts, the images, the videos.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 35:41

Yes, I always tell my students, Kristina, that if you produce a portfolio and it doesn't impress you, how do you expect it to impress me, as your teacher, as the reader, or any other person that is going to interact with your portfolio? It's exactly what Norm is saying, that you must take ownership and take pride in your portfolio.

Kristina Hoeppner: 35:59

Thank you so much, Mpho-Entle, and also Norm for giving us a small glimpse into that massive project that you had going on last year with so, so many different stories from around the world, research papers, best practice studies, case studies, examples of use in so many different contexts, so that there is something for everybody in there wanting to look at portfolios and how they might want to use them in the future. I already look forward to the webinar that we are going to have in May to talk more about that and have a session with portfolio practitioners and researchers to expand on what has been published in the book.

Mpho-Entle Modise: 36:47

Thank you.

Kristina Hoeppner: 36:48

Now over to our listeners. As you think about your own portfolio work, what resonated most with you today? Share your thoughts on LinkedIn, Bluesky, or Mastodon and tag me or send me an email. This was 'Create. Share. Engage.' with Associate Professor Dr Mpho-Entle Modise and Professor Dr Norm Vaughan. Make sure to check out the resources in the episode notes in your podcast app or at podcast.mahara.org. And if you find this valuable, share it with a colleague who would appreciate it, too. Our next episode will air in two weeks. Until then, create, share, and engage.